Q: Dr Gopeesingh, after four years as Minister of Education, do you have any regrets taking up this office?
A: (Eyes closed and a slight pause in the conference chamber of the Parliament, Wednesday afternoon) In life you must learn to do the things that are entrusted upon you and the things that you would like to do. In terms of regrets, absolutely not. When I was asked by the Honourable Prime Minister if I would accept this position, it was a privilege to me…an honour to be asked, and I considered it to be a great challenge.
In accepting, did you envisage the state of some of the schools would be as they are today...violence, and sexual relations leading to pregnancy among the students?
I knew there was always indiscipline among the students, but not in the extent I have seen since I have been minister. With the advent of social media, it became more widely exposed and, therefore, it falls upon us all in the society to put our heads together to do what is absolutely needed to correct the ills. Basically, it is a reflection of what is happening in society, and we all have to play our part in stemming this unsatisfactory situation among students.
Please do not forget that the child spends only a few hours in school, but most of the time the child is at home, so what happens at home is critically important as well.
When people hear about eight girl students in one class are pregnant, do you see your stewardship as a failure?
(Eyes opened) Failure has never been a part of my life at all. I work assiduously to deal with challenges, and this has proven to be a challenge, and I attacked this issue on a variety of fronts and…
Would you say those measures have failed?
No. We have made significant impact on the whole issue of indiscipline among the students. We have established school-based management teams, the Student Support Services Division has been strengthened, local school boards, we have introduced values and ethics in the system, we have health and safety personnel in the school, and the ministry has been retraining teachers in mediation and dispute resolution.
I am calling on all the leaders of society, including the churches, the NGOs, the CBOs, and parents in particular, to do their part in terms of disciplining students at home, and you will see that students who have support at home do not display this type of indiscipline. But that’s just one aspect of the education system. Now, Clevon, I know this is your interview and you are focusing on the negatives, but what about the achievements of the ministry?
Ok, we will come to that...can you continue?
(Eyes opened and are quickly closed again) As far as the issue with the girls being pregnant in school, I have asked for a report from the Chief Education Officer…
Didn’t you approach the president of the National Parent Teachers Association who broke the story and refused to give the ministry the relevant information?
Subsequent to that, a lot of work has been done from the school supervisors, the support services, and the Chief Education Officer has in fact met some of the major stakeholders on the way forward in some of these matters. The whole question of under-age pregnancies has been an issue for a number of years, which has been totally unacceptable.
I have been advised that sex education has been under the health and family life education programme. Speaking to various stakeholders now, most of the NGOs internationally and those responsible for that type of education, they spoke to the issue of that being taught in schools as a separate subject, and I believe this is the way we prefer to move, rather just in the context of health and family education.
Mr Minister, there is another aspect to this thorny issue of girl students becoming pregnant…where are these irresponsible males (boys and men) who impregnate the girls?
The issue of statutory rape occurs with girls under 16 years of age, there is no question of that. But the statistics show that a lot of these fathers are within their 20s and 30s. The fathers, you have asked? Once that is determined by the Students Support Services Division, the teacher or the principal, they have the responsibility of informing the relevant authorities and the police. It is the responsibility of the law-enforcement agencies to follow up those cases.
If we should now look at some of the achievements of your ministry since assuming office... and I think the ministry also takes out newspaper advertisements showing up its performances…
(Laughs) Not at all. I don’t think I need to advertise. In fact, I have been accused of not putting out the things we have been doing successfully over the last four years.
We have delivered about 80 per cent of what we had promised in our first manifesto, and leading off is the ICT initiative—the one laptop per child—infrastructural development, universal childhood education, the special-needs students, improvements in literacy and numeracy, teacher training and development, career-path guidance for all students, organisational restructuring, institutional strengthening, stronger parenting aspect, Tech-voc education, introduction of more cadets, boy scouts, girl guides, gymnasiums…
That is quite a mouthful, Mr Minister, let’s mash brakes…
I could talk to you for hours on our achievements, and looking at some of them, I want to thank all the teachers, schools supervisors, the ministry’s staff, parents, students, principals, for the tremendous amount of work they have done to make these things a reality.
I don’t think I have taken a holiday over the last four years. (Eyes closed again and face leaning in the palm of his hand.)
What about some of the ministry’s immediate targets?
Well, completing the remaining 20 per cent of what we have set about to achieve, and we brought in the smart classroom in Trinidad, so we are moving ICT to a different level. I want to do a lot more work for the special-needs students; we have to achieve universal early childhood education; improvement in teacher training.
We have built 73 schools so far since we went into office—early childhood, primary and secondary. I have 15 secondary schools under construction, another 17 primary under construction, 26 EECs are under construction, and another 15 will start shortly.
Corporal punishment?
We have signed on to the Convention for the Rights of the Child and there will be no deviation from that. The Prime Minister, when she was Minister of Education, accepted that policy and it has proven to be the right policy by international best practice. There is no “ifs” and “buts” about that.
Does the Government intend to legislate the banning of corporal punishment at homes?
(Amazed expression) Banning corporal punishment at home? No. No. No. I am speaking about corporal punishment at schools. We have no jurisdiction over what is happening at home.
Aren’t some people interpreting the PM’s recent statement on this matter as just that?
Not at all. The Prime Minister never made mention of banning corporal punishment at home. She indicated that every case has its own merits, and one has to look at individuals to see where parents may want to go and what the parents may want to do...but as far as homes are concerned, there is no legislation for that and that has never crossed the minds of those responsible for creating the legislative measures under this administration.
Mr Minister, when you look at the sort of anti-social behaviour at schools, how can a parent or parents play a more positive role in moulding the ideal attitudes in schoolchildren?
(Stretching a leg and rubbing his left knee) First of all, we have to bring back the absent fathers, make them more responsible in being role models for these children.
How do you intend to catch them?
It is not a matter of catching them. There is a law for fathers who are not supporting their children—and there are thousands out there who have not been supporting their families. You cannot build a jail for all of them…you cannot do that. You have to use moral suasion, you have to encourage the fathers by whatever means, and they have to start a bond with the younger ones. However, a lot of them are coming around to the fact that they have roles and responsibility and are gravitating back to their children.
And the mothers and grandparents who are there are doing a tremendous job in helping these children along.
I gather there is a law which ensures parents send their children to school?
Ages six to 12 years old. But pretty shortly, we would bring something to Parliament to change the compulsory age for students to attend. Whether it is five to 16, we believe that most people seem to think that should be the compulsory age we should legislate on.
We are bringing more security officers back into the system, and we are improving the amount of people under the Student Support Services. We now have 732 personnel in that division alone—guidance counsellors, school social workers, medical clinical behavioural psychologists—and we are beefing up the curriculum division as well as retraining the principals and supervisors.
So I feel very positive about the work we have done and continue to do. I believe the system has undergone some major transformation in re-engineering and retooling to the benefit of our 250,000 students, 16,000 teachers, and the nation as a whole.
As far as you are concerned the education system is in good hands...
You know, Clevon, we are looked upon as a world leader in education, and remember when the former US secretary of state Hillary Clinton indicated at the recent IADB Forum that we are one of six countries that are being recognised by Unesco as a world leader. And right here in the Caribbean, T&T is being acknowledged as the first country to introduce the smart class system.
In conclusion, Clevon, I want to thank the Honourable Prime Minister for giving me the opportunity to work in education, and will continue to do my best. And I hope to achieve the 100 per cent promise we have made in our manifesto by the end of this year.